Reply #49: Alright, I'll wrap this up... [View All]

[Iowa]

"Not in the way they are phrased in the list. Again, your reading comprehension - in particular the ability to interpret according to CONTEXT - is sorely lacking."

There's nothing quite like watching someone yammering about something they simply don't get. It's like watching Gilda Radner's character, Emily Litella, on Saturday Night Live. Based upon the brash manner in which you charge headlong into matters you know very little about, I suspect that you're too young to remember that skit - but maybe you've seen it on re-runs. At least Emily had the good sense to grin and say, "never-mind", when she realized her predicament.

"Context". What are you trying to pull here? This isn't about "context". Any fourth grader can see through that simplistic, superficial excuse. The following two comments in the OP belittle and ridicule the tenets of the faith of a great many Dems in ANY context. The fact that you can't see it is evidence that you are (for lack of a better phrase) tone-deaf:

1) "...you have no problem believing that the Holy Spirit impregnated Mary, who then gave birth to a man-god who got killed, came back to life and then ascended into the sky."


2) "...some idiot rolling around on the floor speaking in "tongues" may be all the evidence you need to "prove" Christianity."

You just can't see it. It goes right over your head. You don't understand that when one presumes to characterize the values or beliefs of any group to which he/she does not belong, especially when it comes to matters of race, creed, sex, national origin, etc., it requires a certain finesse. You clearly don't get that. And even if you did, you'd screw it up because you are (for lack of a better phrase) tone deaf. Anyone who cannot grasp (even after it is pointed out to them) how the two characterizations above might be construed as ridicule of the religious beliefs/practices of many progressive Dems is like a bull in a china shop. But you don't give a rip. Other Dems might find your comments to be obnoxious, they might want to disassociate themselves from you, they might be left trying to explain away the blunders you make ("this guy doesn't speak for us... please understand that every large group has its crackpots") - but you don't care. Because you're always right. You have it all figured out. For every one who thinks like you, there are hundreds who don't, but they're all idiots. Yeah, our side has them too.

And another thing... YOU are not the judge of whether a characterization of a creed to which you do not belong is offensive or not. What matters is how those who are actually lampooned feel about it. Some progressive Christian Dems on DU took offense. But you don't care. Screw them! You know better. But here's the deal: When it comes to lampooning a creed to which you don't belong, nobody gives a rip whether you think it is offensive or not. But you don't get that. It goes right over your head.

"...similar myths present in other religions."

Ah, now these are YOUR words - not the OP's. Referring to the resurrection and the ascension as "myths" is condescending to those of the Christian faith and would turn off many Christian Dems, especially when uttered in a political arena. Again, you appear to be completely tone deaf. You're a blunder waiting to happen. No polish, no sensitivity, no finesse... and you don't give a damn. The rest of us are left to clean up your gaffes while you remain completely oblivious - because you're RIGHT! Granted, most Dems would probably just write such remarks off as the ramblings of a crackpot. Nevertheless, Dems who make such comments about the faith of other Dems serve our enemies ("See... they think your faith is a fairy tale. They think you're idiots.") You help their cause and hurt ours when you ridicule the beliefs of our candidates and most of our rank and file as "myths". I suggest you knock it off and you refuse. So there it is. And that's where it will remain.

In a previous post you claimed: "Tolerant Democratic Christians are highly unlikely to believe any of the "tenets" in the OP." Yet the OP included this remark: "...some idiot rolling around on the floor speaking in "tongues" may be all the evidence you need to "prove" Christianity." What you obviously don't know is there are many Catholics and Protestants who participate in practices typically viewed to be the purview of some of the Pentecostal religions. And many of them are Dems. You obviously don't know that. I know several of these people. Furthermore, you can't even grasp how this comment in the OP could be considered offensive! That's why comments designed to lampoon religion are best left to those with at least a rudimentary understanding of the subject (preferably members of the religion) and a bit of finesse. A progressive Christian would have tweaked the OP and probably would have pulled it off.

And take off your "I'm a persecuted Christian" goggles before you do, mmkay?

Why would you think I was being "persecuted"? All I'm saying is that it is dumb to create rifts, for no good reason, and based upon matters of personal faith that have nothing to do with public policy. I'm posting on a Dem board, supporting a Democratic agenda, and voting/donating/working for political candidates who are both Dem and Christian - just like me. Furthermore, most Dems are Christian - just like me. I am in the MAJORITY. Do you not get that? The religious right is pushing the notion that Christians are being persecuted and such nonsense is ridiculous on its face and we shouldn't be repeating it here. Furthermore, I'm saying that I want religion OUT of politics. Yet you insist upon bringing it in by seeking gratuitous fights about religion. You appear to be so blinded by your anger toward the Christian right that you are unable to distinguish between the Christian right, and all the Christians who stand with you as Dems on matters of public policy - people like John Kerry, Jimmy Carter, Howard Dean, Richard Gephardt, Al Sharpton, Al Gore, Dennis Kucinich, Ted Kennedy, John Conyers, most Dems, me, and all the other DUers who are Christian... The inability to distinguish between your allies who are Christian (and who want religion out of politics), and your enemies who are Christian (and who want a theocracy) is not only an intellectual blunder, but a strategic one that diverts energy from the important issues of freedom and economic security that we all face. I'm suggesting that you knock it off. You refuse. And that's where it will remain.

By the way, you might want to reconsider using the word "mmkay". It comes across as rather petulant, and some might consider it to be a little effeminate. It isn't a big deal, really, but I'd nix it if I were you.