Regardless of whether Vick was involved or not, can we all agree

[hedgehog]

that dog fighting and cock fighting are past times that need to go away?

[EV_Ares]

1. Absolutely without question & I hope that all of those involved

suffer the same fate as the dogs.

[hedgehog]

4. I'd settle for massive fines.

This so-called sport is just a way to make money gambling.

Of course, bringing back the stocks isn't a bad idea. I'd put the criminals behind some protective shielding, but I think putting them on public display is the best deterrent.

[dflprincess]

7. Not just fines, jail time as well

n/t

[ConsAreLiars]

14. You think that "This so-called sport is just a way to make money gambling." ???

This is sadism, pure and simple.

[EV_Ares]

15. Yeah, agree, I am just one that really gets pissed seeing those that

abuse those that are unable to defend themselves, animals, children, the elderly. You & I can fight back but the others can't. I will go with the stocks and public humiliation with lots & lots of money fines in this case. He could give a few mil to all of the animal causes.

[Bake]

48. Protective shielding kinda defeats the point.

What good is it if you can't stop by and piss on 'em?

Bake

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

2. We agree here. Now, post this on FR.

:popcorn: MKJ

[jgraz]

3. heh -- I'd pay to watch freeper fighting

That's pretty much all they're good for.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

6. Nicely done.

:toast: irony. MKJ

[lonestarnot]

9. Candy Creepie Crawlie and Bob Novakula

[lastknowngood]

5. And let's all agree that whether O.J. was involved in his wifes death

that murder with a big ass knife is a past time that needs to go away.

[Frogger]

8. He's lucjy

my wife couldn't get at him when she heard the news.:+

[emilyg]

10. Yes.

[Louie the XIV]

11. Unfortunately some in this country see these brutal bloodsports as part of their "heritage"

see the hispanic defense of cockfighting in New Mexico.

[pitohui]

12. probably not

i don't know much about dogs but i know that you are killing the spirit of the species in re cock fighting -- male chickens LOVE to fight, it's in their nature -- so it is hard for me to agree w. a cockfighting ban when it essentially means killing all high testosterone varieites of these birds

[hedgehog]

16. I agree with you that male chickens love to fight, BUT there is a big

difference between a pair of roosters in an open yard and a pair in a fighting pit. For one thing, my roosters are only equipped with what Mother Nature gave them. Their spurs are pretty nasty, but they aren't steel blades. Generally, a rooster fight consists of half a dozen bluff challenges and one rooster walks away. The roosters in the pit can't leave.



A real rooster challenge is beautiful to watch. The two roosters face off, raise their hackles and bob their heads up and down several times. One charges, the other ducks, and the first one does a fly over. Repeat several times until one bird walks away.

I've had a couple of roosters around the yard for 20 years; including the infamous period when we had about 12. (we bought chicks at the feed store for a Junior High production of WIzard of Oz. Straight run, my ass!) In all that time, only two roosters have gotten hurt. Both had an eye scratched when they tried to hold the dominant position against a much younger bird.

[mondo joe]

18. I think nature can provide nicely for the species without people creating artificial

cockfight scenarios, including spurs and no way to exit (which is the typical conclusion to most natural cockfights).

[flvegan]

20. You have to be shitting me.

Just when I think I've seen it all here...

[LostinVA]

41. Just remember

Jesus Chicken

[The Stranger]

59. Oh for fuck's sake.

Please tell my you are kidding.

[CreekDog]

61. Most uninformed post, ever

Saying that banning cockfighting means killing all roosters (with high testosterone).

[Forkboy]

62. LMAO

Oy vey...what a funny ole world.

[RandomKoolzip]

82. Duh

[Jed Dilligan]

13. What about boxing and ultimate fighting?

I guess the difference is consent/intent. Yet aren't human male fighters in some sense as conditioned as trained beasts? This raises some interesting philosophical issues.

I wouldn't go to a dog or cockfight, but I don't know if law enforcement is necessarily the answer. They tend to make problems worse.

[hedgehog]

17. I am sickened by the increased sale of violence, real or feigned,

as entertainment or sport.

[LostinVA]

25. Boxing and ultimate fighting is nowhere near the same thing

They're athletes, not trained beasts. There isn't a criminal culture built around it, and for the most part, they're just average people outside of the ring. I tried boxing and I found it empowering. My fiance used to compete in full-contact karate and is taking up boxing. I wouldn't refer to her a trained beast.

If law enforcement isn't necessarily the answer, then what is your answer? Ask the thugs to please kindly stop abusing animals?

[Jed Dilligan]

58. No criminal culture around boxing?

That's news to me.

I don't have any answers, but I know that cops are never a good solution to social or cultural problems.

[quinnox]

19. I don't like dogs

Dogs IMHO are disgusting creatures.

As far as cockfighting, eh no big deal. Heck we eat chickens every day.


edited to add - As far as Vick goes, I don't have sympathy for idiotic thuggish multi millioniare athletes of any stripe. So I can only say throw the book at him, although I'm sure he will get away with it. It has been shown a few times that if you are a super rich male athlete star you can get away with anything, even murder.

[LostinVA]

21. Oh brother

[myrna minx]

23. So because you don;t like dogs and you eat chickens anyway,

vicious blood "sports" are ok to you? :puke:

[mondo joe]

24. So no problem with torture of animals? Sure you're on the right board?

Or the right planet?

[quinnox]

26. Yes I'm sure

I'm on the right board, thanks. No, I'm not for torture of animals, do you know what exaggeration is? You seem to be masterful at it.

No, I won't give up eating chickens in order to get more DU "cred" or to please some anonymous asshole on DU.

I love certain animals, for example cats are wonderful and beautiful creatures.

[LostinVA]

27. Dogfighting and cockfighting ARE torture

What would you call it?

[myrna minx]

29. Perhaps we could petition Tyson to change their slaughter practices and

institute cockfighting as a more efficient way to bring chicken to your table. :sarcasm: :crazy:

[quinnox]

32. whoops I guess I disagree with that!

god forbid I dissent from the popular accepted Du opinion! How heretical, will I now lose all my progressive credentials?

What would I call dogfighting and cockfighting? Well, the animals involved are just following their natural instincts, so I would call it nature in action. Pitbulls were bred to fight. It is part of their hereditary.

Have you ever seen the savagery that goes on in the wild? Does that bother Du progressives too? Too bad it is only natural.

[mondo joe]

35. Ah, "natural instincts". Ignorance is bliss.

In nature, both dog and cock fights rarely result in serious injury. They tend to be mostly show and bluster, and end with one of the opponents yielding or exiting.

In cock and dog fights the animals are prevented from following their instincts, with no exit or opportunity to back down. They are bred, trained and required to fight, even to the death. In the case of cock fighting, the birds are sometimes equipped with metals spurs with which to inflict greater damage on each other.

How the fuck natural do you think that is?

[quinnox]

47. ok you win

You happy now? Can I stay on the board? You win the argument. But guess what I still don't like dogs, and about the main subject the OP was about, I still don't really care about it all that much. So sue me if I don't put dogfighting and cockfighting on the top of my list of priorities! I happen to think there are far more important issues to worry about. Jesus...

[mondo joe]

50. Strawman.

No one said dog or cockfighting should be at the top of your list of priorities.

While I'm sure you have far more important issues to worry about, that didn't prevent you from spending time replying in this thread.

So it seems you can't be bothered to be worried about the right side of the issue, but you can be bothered to be inaccurate and wrong.

[Judi Lynn]

56. Learn to think FIRST, then communicate. n/t

[lukasahero]

79. If you're not interested

why are you bothering with this thread?

[myrna minx]

36. My, what a maverick!

If you don't see the difference between the behavior of animals in the wild and animals being fed gun powder to make the animals agitated, being abused in order to provoke a fight, electrocuting or hanging animals that lose then either you are purposefully being obtuse or are basking in ignorance. Either way is sad.

[LostinVA]

39. Go read the indictment then

come back here and tell me that it's natural.

And I'm not sure if you've ever had progressive credentials.

[quinnox]

49. you win!

You win the argument, happy now?

[LostinVA]

51. Oh brother

[Forkboy]

66. Awwww....poor guy.

Here,this is for you.

:hug:

[LanternWaste]

44. The martyr card always works well, I guess... n/t

The self-proclaimed martyr card always works well, I guess... :eyes:

[yardwork]

55. I don't think that you know anything at all about dog fighting or cock fighting

There's nothing natural about it and the animals are not just "following their natural instincts." Why don't you google it and learn a little? Educate yourself.

[myrna minx]

28. Who's exaggerating now? The OP asked if we could all agree

that we find professional animal fighting repugnant. It has nothing to do with eating chickens. :crazy:

[mondo joe]

30. Talk about exaggeration.

No one asked you to give up chicken. No one said you should.

And I don't give a shit what you eat.

The point was - and is - that you have no objection to TORTURE of animals - at least not dogs or roosters.

[Bake]

52. Dogs are disgusting creatures?

Holy crap! How can anybody think dogs are disgusting creatures?

Somebody, please feel free to post cute puppy pics in response ...

Bake

[CreekDog]

65. Dogs are better than people in my experience

But regardless, no person or animal should be subjected to forced fighting and injury for sport, scratch that, for gaming. Because this is all about making money off wagering on these poor creatures.

[malta blue]

53. I'm not fond of snakes but I don't think they should be abused

for the entertainment of some sick jerks.

I can't believe what you are saying about dogs and chickens...:crazy:

[Forkboy]

63. More comedy!

This is turning into a good thread!

[NaturalHigh]

22. You got my vote.

[sandnsea]

31. I need an aspirin

This thread is insane. I eat chickens so cock fighting is grand??? Humans fight so who cares about dogs? Laws make everything worse?? So fucking cuckoo I can't even comment. Another when you think you've heard it all moment.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

33. What about bull fighting?

I mean, I'm fine if people don't like it, and want it to be illegal here. But if I ever visited Spain, I think I'd like to see a bull fight. And I think I'd be a real ass if I told the Spanish I thought there was something wrong with their culture.

:shrug:

[mondo joe]

38. You'd be an ass if you told someone there was something wrong with their culture?

:rofl:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

40. Yeah.

And a bigot, I think.

[mondo joe]

42. I suppose I'll have to ask: So how do you feel about apartheid, not letting women vote,

sexual mutilation of little girls, jailing men for being homosexuals?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

43. I'd feel...

like that was argumentum ad absurdum.

:shrug:

[CreekDog]

69. Born: actually to suggest that bullfighting is legitimate b/c it's in their culture

Is a slur against Spaniards.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

70. To suggest that bullfighting is illegitimate because you don't like it...

is your opinion and I can respect that.

So don't go bullfighting.

:shrug:

[CreekDog]

74. It's illegitimate because it's cruel

Whether I like it or not is immaterial.

Are you arguing that bullfighting isn't cruel?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

75. I think it's borderline.

I can respect people who think it's cruel and should be outlawed. I can respect people who enjoy it, and want to keep doing it.

[CreekDog]

76. What makes it okay to "like" bullfighting?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

77. The same thing that makes it OK to not like it.

[CreekDog]

78. So we just make up our own morals?

Vick didn't seem to see anything wrong with what he's accused of.

[LanternWaste]

46. I argued against bull fighting when I lived in Mexico. ..

I fought against my baser instincts while living in Mexico and never went to one, additionally, I argued against bull fighting . Never earned me the sobriquet of 'ass'-- at least, not in Mexico.

But that's just me...

[Balbus]

57. Don't worry. You don't need to tell the Spanish anything to be a real ass...

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

64. So what do you think about Spanish bull fighting, Balbus?

:evilgrin:

[CreekDog]

71. And if you think bullfighting is wrong here

You would be a hypocrite for going to see one in Spain.

Yes, I might feel my trip to Spain is incomplete without a trip to see the bullfight, but then again, when you listen to your conscience, life is a little less fun. But don't worry, it's still the right thing to do --not go to the bullfight.

Going to the bullfight is partcipation and acquiesence in what's going on there and although we can be tarred with what our countries/socieites do (somewhat unfairly), if you attend a bullfight to enjoy it, pay to get in, take pictures, etc. Let's face it, you are supporting bullfighting in a way that you can't really argue that you don't. It's not as if you are filming a documentary to get it banned by the UN after all.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

73. Oh, I don't think it's "wrong" here.

But if the majority of the people want to keep it illegal, I'm not going to put up a fuss. I respect their opinions.

[CreekDog]

68. Some cultures support female circumcision

And I don't find a damn thing wrong with saying that's fu**ed up. It's not bigoted at all.

So, if you think bullfighting is cruel and you say so, that's fine. Judgement of a culture is perfectly legitimate especially if it is to defend or protect a weak member of that society.

And if they get upset about it, they can criticize our culture too, we are not perfect.

[-..__...]

80. FTR... I'm against bullfighting.

However, since the event is never conducted in this country, it's not my place to say how and why another country should legislate/condemn/ban a particular activity.

Anyhoo... at least with bull fighting the bull sometimes prevails and administers a serious ass-tuning to the participants.

[CreekDog]

81. Sure it's your place to say what you think

And it's their place to point out the flaws in our society. You have a place, just not citizenship there to actually cause that change to take place.

Frankly, if we both took each other's advice, this would be a better world.

Politeness is not the highest virtue.

[ceile]

34. The ignore feature is my friend.

Those of you who think it's "no big deal" or it's "in their nature" need some serious help.

[mondo joe]

37. The poster(s) who have said it's natural just keep proving how ignorant they are, both

of nature and the activity.

But ignorance doesn't get in the way of them shooting their mouths off.

[ceile]

45. Very true. n/t

[Louie the XIV]

54. I have come to the conclusion that there are a large number of posters on here

who will argue ridiculous and unprincipled positions just to be contrarian and start an argument.

It appears that 2 of the more outspoken ones have already appeared on this thread. They feed off attention so if you ignore them they will go away.

[lies and propaganda]

60. Cock fighting was finally just now made illegal in Louisiana

i was shocked as shit to find that an hour away from where I grew up, busloads of people from Texas and Okla showing up in Lake Charles to cockfight cause it was freaking legal.. Thats when i started writing letters and a few years later they have finally made it illegal.

[AngryAmish]

67. As one of the few DUers who has been to cockfights

I have no problem with making cockfighting illegal if most people want it to be illegal. But I don't really think cockfighting is morally wrong.

I do have a problem with dogfighting.

[CreekDog]

72. Just because you are calloused to cockfighting

doesn't make it right.

[Disturbed]

83. Cruelty to humans & animals is barbaric.

Cobra vs mongoos is another cruel event. Cruel practices should not be ignored just because they are popular or part of the historic tradition.