I saw a woman on MSNBC...

[one_voice]

she's been out of work for 8 months. The host, Contessa Brewer (sp?) was asking why she doesn't retrain, look for other fields to work in etc. So the woman says, how am I supposed to meet my basic needs, food, shelter, etc while I'm retraining? I've gone through my savings, and my 401, and my family and friends aren't a lot better than I am. Her unemployment has run out too.

The she said....Prsioners are treated better than the unemployed right now; they have their basic needs met, food, shelter, etc. I thought that was very telling. We have people-through no fault of their own-going hungry, homeless, etc and somehow those in Washington try and make it out to be their fault.

There has got to be a better way. How does a child molester, or a murderer live better (not hungry, health care etc) than someone who lost their job and can't find another--thanks to the fuckwads-in Washington? WTF?!?





:mad: :grr: :banghead:

edited for leaving out something.

[polichick]

1. Don't forget that we can also thank "the fuckwads in Washington"...

...for incarcerating millions of people - especially people of color - who should be in the work force. If they were being counted, there would be even more unemployment.

[SpiralHawk]

127. ...and their corporate media spin stooges

ptoooey...

[molly77]

148. A FB friend recently was visiting

family in Europe. She said that Europeans were turning against the US govt. because of the way they are treating their citizens.Sicko has some revealing information about the way other countries think. A conservative in Canada stated that you would never allow other people to go without medical care just because they could not afford it. The whole world is passing US by because of our greed.Our MSM puts the poor down in a thousand different ways daily.

[sasha031]

2. "why doesn't she retrain?"

how ignorant and lacking in empathy , retrain for what? greeter at walmart. I find daytime cable so lame.
thank you for posting that very real humane story of this poor woamn.

[Mimosa]

3. With tuition money from where? Or maybe she could JOIN THE MILITARY!!! n/t

[sasha031]

19. pundit's and the beltway live in an alternate reality

[Hannah Bell]

46. oh, but they could get a student loan & put themselves in debt for the rest of their lives,

you know.

thanks to the kindness of our masters.

[eShirl]

9. It's the new "Let them eat cake."

[HCE SuiGeneris]

77. Bingo

You nailed it.

[lib_wit_it]

164. So where are the new revolutionaries? What is the new guillotine? Is there a peaceful means to

unseat the new aristocracy? Or are Americans too doped with religion and sex and tv to see that they're just fucking peasants, just like you and me?

[SharonAnn]

82. Retrain for what jobs? There are no jobs! Training doesn't matter.

[fasttense]

130. So true.

What job can you retrain for? Teacher, police or firefighter? They are getting laid off too. How about maid, fast food server, sales clerk? Those are the up and coming jobs.

[SemperEadem]

144. not only ask what to retrain for

but also which country has that job been outsourced to that one is training for?

See, what's the point in retraining if the jobs are all in India?

[DollyM]

168. boy isn't that the truth! I have a Master's degree and it is pretty much worthless in this economy!

I found a job that pays 10 dollars and hour (way down from what I made years ago) and am happy with that since it does at least provide health insurance. Every month is a struggle just to pay the bills and I cut corners every way that I can. My heat is set at 55 in my house all the time to keep the heating bill down. I bring my lunch to work every day and round out my groceries with supplies from the local food pantry. But at least I have a job . . .

[wryter2000]

170. +1

"Are there no prisons? Are there no work-houses?"

[midnight]

88. Exactly....

[barbtries]

108. another example of what the fucking republicans

have done to this country. in 1995 i was where this woman is, with three minor children no less. lost my job, my home, custody of two of my children. back in the day through the unemployment department i was sent to computer school for six months and was able to get a job making a living wage. the cost to society for that training was, as my SIL said at the time, pennies on the dollar. after a year i was able to get a job, a home of my own, BACK ON MY FEET. i have paid the cost of my training and much, much more back in taxes since then. two of my children are pursuing higher educations. these programs are gone now. yes retraining is a great idea and society should be happy to foot the bill. but cold hearted republicans would have rather have seen me on the street and my son who was only 3 at the time relegated to flipping burgers his whole life for the crime of poverty. they're getting their wish with millions unemployed and every safety net available being stripped away for the comfort of the few.

very sad. so wrong.

[Historic NY]

114. Lots of retraining schemes out there are just plain ripoffs....

that take money from the student & the government w/o producing anything.

[snappyturtle]

122. Contessa Brewer is.......an idiot! She has been on my try not to

listen to list for years. I heard her once ask a soldier's mother why she was so fearful for her son instead of being overcome with pride that he was fighting for our country! OMG! Hopefully, CB doesn't have any children or thoughts of breeding.

[dbmk]

126. Or maybe it was a question meant to lead to that answer

So the viewer is not left with that question unanswered.

[originalpckelly]

4. I couldn't agree more with that woman.

Why is it that we'll take care of people who committed heinous acts, yet not people who are just unlucky in life?

[asdjrocky]

5. It was like watching the hot girs making fun of the plain girl.

It really made me sick. All the news is now is rich people talking about or to richer people. It's funny when you can almost see them holding their nose to take some time with the "regular people".

[timefortherevolution]

147. THANK YOU! That's what its become!

I can recall watching Morning Joe about a year and a half ago.
Listening to the panel of millionaires do nothing but GRIPE about their
coming tax increase.

In the meantime, unemployment was spiraling, the cost of college educations
is out of reach, millions of people losing their homes.

And all that panel could do was kvetch about their taxes going up.

[gratuitous]

6. Did Contessa ask her why the woman didn't dip into her trust fund?

Sure, you don't have money for bread, that's an understandable hardship. But why don't you eat cake, then?

[Swamp Rat]

15. Contessa Antoinette and her piece of cake

[sasha031]

23. that's Contessa, I remember her

my question is, why are most of the female pundits (journalists?) on tv so dumb, and usually blond. They all look the same to me, as if they are cloned.
They are an insult to what real intelligent women are about.

[DenverDad]

49. Because teabaggers

like pretty shiny boxes with nothing inside.

[daleanime]

90. Oh my.....

you hit that once pretty hard.:fistbump:

[madmax]

155. lol great line. nt

[gratuitous]

25. I will exert my maximum effort

And try to put a good face on this line of questioning. Let's see . . .

:think:

Perhaps these inane questions were meant to draw out the fact that some of the standard idiot objections put forth by conservatives (get retraining, go back to school, try getting work in another field while competing against similarly situated unemployed persons who have experience) are just plain nonsensical. It is good that someone actually in the situation of being unemployed long term has a chance to explain, first hand, how horrible that situation is.

:hurts:

Whew! How'd I do?

[Art_from_Ark]

80. It's just another variation on that tired Republican meme

"Pull yourself up by your bootstraps, ya lazy bum!"

:puke:

[NuttyFluffers]

54. i love how her name means "Countess." apropos, nu?

i just let the waves of dark humor that is our modern political & media experience wash over me, like the polluted water of the Gulf, tar balls and all... it's taxing to watch the world go to hell from here, lying on the beach trying to keep the salt water from splashing into my pina colada.

[Buns_of_Fire]

62. That got me thinking... Where are the "Billionaires for Bush" these days?

I know they ducked under for a short while and resurfaced as "Billionaires for Wealthcare," but it seems that perhaps their services could be used again. A little pointed street theater couldn't hurt...

[awoke_in_2003]

93. they probably got fed up with the fact...

that very few understood what they were doing. That and the fact that the democratic party isn't much different.

[4 t 4]

72. Love you Swamp Rat!!

[dennis4868]

7. But but but....

the media and politicians are telling me on teee veee that the #1 issue is the deficit....the job issue cannot be that important....NOT!

[cilla4progress]

8. So cruel and unrealistic -

I'm glad I'm not such a selfish, elitist, jerk.

[TwilightGardener]

10. "Retrain"--yeah, it's really easy to just go get a degree in something else

within the amount of time (weeks?) that your meager savings and assets can support you and your family. Gawd, the dumb...

[livetohike]

32. With what money? Just go into further debt. These talking heads

and our millionaire politicians really don't have a clue.

[TwilightGardener]

35. Right. Even the quickie diplomas/certificates are still thousands of dollars.

[Buns_of_Fire]

63. What debt? The banksters aren't going to lend an unemployed person any money!

We are sooooooooooo screwed...

[Subdivisions]

11. The President is going to work on this as soon as he gets back from Afghanistan.

:eyes:

[TwilightGardener]

12. Criticizing Obama for visiting commanders, troops and the Afghan Prez

during a war...I mean, just fucking beyond stupid.

[sasha031]

26. I thought this was a place people are aloud to express there feelings

about a situation. I didn't hear anyone criticizing our war president about the ongoing wars.

[Subdivisions]

28. You're only allowed to express support for Dear Leader. n/t

[sasha031]

29. I can see that...

:eyes:

[AndrewP]

39. Please. No negative words about the President ever in any way.

It's an open forum of ideas among Liberals, but only if you agree with the Pro-Obama crowd. Otherwise please refrain!

[TwilightGardener]

42. You know as well as I that the dominant theme on DU is what an abysmal

failure Obama is. Or, alternatively, what a Republican trojan horse he is. The most-rec'd threads are the ones calling him a Republican and saying we'll never vote for him again. They've changed the rules here to allow over-the-top criticism, in fact. So your post is insanely dishonest, but then we all know that.

[Subdivisions]

48. STUPID fucking war! BEYOND stupid! n/t

[AndrewP]

53. yes! "Insanely"!!! Exactly!!!

[Subdivisions]

58. I'm "stupid" and you're "insanely dishonest" and having a War President is A-OK. n/t

[frylock]

84. it's rather telling that those negative posts are so popular..

what do you make of it? do you think people are genuinely concerned with the direction taken by the admin, or are they all a bunch of poopyheads?

[TwilightGardener]

87. Some are honestly aggrieved and disappointed--with reason. Some will never

give Obama any credit, ever, and are mostly here to win people over to their point of view that he's just the worst thing evah (to the point of smugly congratulating and welcoming people who finally "see the light"). And some are simply trolls. I generally know who's who by now.

[frylock]

91. the amount of people in that camp probably number the same as those who believe he's infallable..

anywhere from 12 to 15 people.

[Cherchez la Femme]

99. So you're categorically calling fellow DU'ers Trolls?

--those, of course, that don't agree with you

I thought there was something in the rules about sentiments such as that....

[truth2power]

171. I said something about trolls in a post the other day, and my post got deleted...

Or maybe it was something else I said. No way to tell, so there's no way to refrain saying what I'm not supposed to say. :crazy:

[polmaven]

141. I agree!

Sometimes I almost think some of them would prefer to go back to what we HAD!

[Mimosa]

161. What we have now isn't much different from what we had.

Nothing for the poor and barely hanging on has improved. The pointless wars and accompanying military spending continue. Our troops are dying and being injured. People are still losing jobs and homes.

Our rights as citizens are still be abridged by the TSA and 'Homeland Security.'

The beat goes on and on and on...

[awoke_in_2003]

94. I guess I am in...

the "poopyhead" category.

[Cherchez la Femme]

97. Oh, thanks

I read that & coke (the liquid kind) came outta my nose when I snorted with laughter!

At least I don't need a new keyboard, lookin on the bright side :P

[frylock]

111. the liquid kind?

mmmhmmmm.... :P

[Cherchez la Femme]

117. LOL

I'm waay too old to indulge in that stuff again. The 80's (and early 90's) were quite enough for me, TYVM!
(But ah, what prodigious mowing we did make! : )

Although a toot now & then I know would help get me out of this catatonic ball I've been in that has progressively getting worser and worser these past 2+ years... heck, I used to keep a pristine house, anyone could eat off my floors;
can't say that now... totally depressed & it's showing not only mentally but physically.

[Dr.Phool]

120. He's not burnishing his credentials much.

The fight of his presidency is taking place right now in Washington, over tax rates. Why isn't he fighting it? He needs to be out front on this.

The only good thing about the Afghan trip is, he didn't get photographed running around with a plastic turkey.

[Bluenorthwest]

140. I like the part where you typed 'Afghan President' instead of

Corrupt Criminal Karzi.

[Chef Eric]

153. Waaaa! It's not fair! The rules have changed!

We are now allowed to angrily criticize our President! It shouldn't be allowed! We should be gagged! We should be silenced!

We should just accept the fact that Obama has appointed Simpson and Bowles to lead the deficit commission. We should just accept the fact that although there is not enough money to maintain Social Security as it exists now, somehow there has been enough money to fight two unnecessary wars, and somehow there will be enough money to continue fighting those unnecessary wars for an indefinite period of time. We should just accept the fact unemployment is at 10%. We should just accept the fact that federal employees will not get raises for at least two years.

[Subdivisions]

47. The 'Pro-Obama' crowd is in a severe minority here. MAJORITY RULES! n/t

[AnArmyVeteran]

56. I'm pro 'candidate' Obama, but I have no idea who 'President' Obama is.

They are two different people.

[Subdivisions]

27. You calling me stupid? HA! n/t

[TwilightGardener]

30. I think criticizing a man for doing a very important aspect of his job is, in fact, BEYOND stupid.

[Subdivisions]

31. Continuing a war in Afghanistan is BEYOND stupid. How about that? n/t

[TwilightGardener]

33. If you think so. But he has to attend to it, regardless. The timing will

never be right for some, here. There will always be a CRISIS or CATASTROPHE or at least a SERIOUS VOTE IN CONGRESS.

[Subdivisions]

34. It's fucking STUPID. STUPID BEYOND BELIEF!

You don't think continuing the war in Afghanistan is STUPID, STUPID, STUPID!?

Anyone who thinks it isn't STUPID BEYOND BELIEF is STUPID BEYOND BELIEF!

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TwilightGardener]

41. He needs to go and see what's happening there, no matter what. But,

acknowledging that reality constitutes waving "pom poms". That's rational.

[Subdivisions]

43. Bull-fucking-shit! His needing to be there is BEYOND STUPID! n/t

[Name removed]

44. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Ripley]

66. Hah!

Doncha know he's the new and improved War President.

How ya doin' Binka? :hi:

[Cherchez la Femme]

102. What's he gonna see?

Raw action? Boots on the ground? Tour a town or front line? Things as they *really* are?
Or a sterile, well-controlled photo-op consisting of a nice lil sit-down with Karzai?

I'd really like to know what he's going to 'see'.
I'll even take what, if any, constructive actions and accords they'll agree on; most of that stuff is done by our generals, envoys & Ambassadors

Whada'mi talking 'most'? All.


And, from what I've seen, it can't help but strike me that the Pres has the most curious timing on running off to other countries.
Very strange indeed, mama (to paraphrase/quote John Lennon).

[Speed8098]

136. acknowledging that reality constitutes waving "pom poms".

The reality is that 92% of Afghans have no idea why they're fighting the American soldiers or even the attack of 9/11 for that matter......
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40273302/ns/world_news-south_and_central_asia/

Now That's a stupid place to hold a war. I really like Obama but I wish he would listen more to those of us on the left that believed everything he told us as a candidate.
I'm not saying he hasn't accomplished some amazing things in such a short period, but ending the war in Afghanistan NOW would be the most amazing........not to mention intelligent.

[awoke_in_2003]

96. Yes, he has to do it regardless...

but the continuation of war in Afghanistan is FUCKING STUPID. We will NEVER get a victory there.

[TheEuclideanOne]

131. Not just stupid..... fucking beyond stupid

Just wanted to clarify that. :)

Reminds me of an article I read somewhat recently entitled "What happens when you are too stupid to realize that you are stupid.". Seemed to apply here.

[frylock]

81. it borders on treason

:eyes:

[TwilightGardener]

89. No, it's just really stupid. On a par with bashing him for meeting with members of Congress, or

visiting disaster areas, or attending dinners with foreign heads of state. It's simply a part of his job, and he must do it.

[inna]

95. what's "fucking beyond stupid" is supporting destructive, harmful policies -

and expecting support from those who know better.

[mediaman007]

14. +1

[closeupready]

16. +2

K&R

[GoCubsGo]

13. I keep hearing the "retrain"/"go back to school" bullshit, too.

Only, not as often as I used to, as I shut them up by asking if they're going to pay for it, since I'm flat broke. Then, I add that I didn't spend four years in college, and three years of bloody hell in grad school to go do something else. Also, even if I wanted to go back, nobody in my field is going to take someone my age on as a PhD student. If you aren't in your 20s or early 30, you are shit out of luck.

[SCRUBDASHRUB]

78. I got laid off when I was 39 (in Jan.). Turned 40 in Sept. How convenient.

[greymattermom]

115. 40s grad student

I took a PhD student who was in his 40s, former vice-president of a telecommunications company. He was the best student I ever had and now has a 6 figure job doing something on the border between business and science. He applied late and talked himself into our program.

[devilgrrl]

17. Another overpaid news bimbette telling everyone else how it's done.

So fucking typical.

[closeupready]

18. To play devil's advocate, I think part of the problem is

that many Americans still hold onto this notion that there is something shameful about asking for help from the government. Corporations and the wealthy don't miss a beat, but hardworking, honest, salt-of-the-Earth Americans still have this idealistic notion about being ruggedly independent and that somehow, this will magically save them. Meanwhile, they deplete their retirement accounts to pay bills, and then will find, come retirement time, that nobody cares.

[awoke_in_2003]

98. very excellent points. nt

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

20. Contessa should know that...

...it's been well documented for years that retraining is not effective, it's just something candidates say when they want to dodge the issue of unemployment, you know, because everything can be solved by the magic of retraining.

I'm really disappointed in Contessa. I expect this level of ignorance from a Fox host.


U.S. Study Says Job Retraining Is Not Effective
By PETER T. KILBORN
Published: October 15, 1993

The Labor Department audit, based on an examination of 1,198 workers in nine states in 1991, found that only one in five of the retrained workers were steered into jobs paying at least 80 percent as much as their old jobs.

The findings were quickly cited by opponents of President Clinton's proposed North American Free Trade Agreement as evidence that the Government cannot easily make up for job losses by retraining workers.


http://www.nytimes.com/1993/10/15/us/us-study-says-job-retraining-is-not-effective.html


Job Retraining May Fall Short of High Hopes
By MICHAEL LUO
Published: July 5, 2009

Nonetheless, a little-noticed study the Labor Department released several months ago found that the benefits of the biggest federal job training program were “small or nonexistent” for laid-off workers. It showed little difference in earnings and the chances of being rehired between laid-off people who had been retrained and those who had not.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/06/us/06retrain.html

[Laelth]

68. Excellent post. Thanks for that. n/t

-Laelth

[Cherchez la Femme]

105. When prison looks better than being homeless

y'know, a cot, 3 squares, hot showers, a roof over ones head, heat in winter and at least a fan in summer
of which utilities you don't have to pay an arm & a leg for

(not to mention complete medical *including* dental!)

over the prospect of being destitute; living out of a car on on the streets with no income, nothing

there's a BIG problem in this country

[kath]

118. Second the thanks for that post and links - veddy inteddesting.

[treestar]

21. They are in prison; their freedom is constrained

What a stupid thing to say.

[DiverDave]

61. But they aint starving

or sleeping under a bridge.
Oh and that root canal?

Taken care of...

[one_voice]

71. It's not stupid...

the point is you can be the worst of society and you're still gonna get the basics necessities...food, and shelter, they also get health care, dental, they're able to educate themselves etc.

The point is, these people are not left to "fall through the cracks" and people who-through no fault of their own-do fall through the cracks. Including children, the elderly, vets, and disabled people.

This country has been run into the ground by the rich and greedy, without a second thought to all the people that are suffering so their bank accounts get fatter.

The safety nets that are supposed to work, have been stretched till they broke.

I wonder how many parents would limit their freedom to make sure their child(ren) have shelter and food. You know the basics needed to live. It's a sad state of affairs.

[Wednesdays]

76. Who says the unemployed peoples' freedoms aren't constrained?

Yeah, these people can go all sorts of places. :sarcasm:

[awoke_in_2003]

101. "freedom" isn't free...

plenty of nameless people die every year to keep the illusion alive. In those pictures, only on person is actually loved- and that love is given by a dog :(

[frylock]

85. way to miss the point entirely

jfc

[Cherchez la Femme]

103. When prison looks better than being homeless

y'know, a cot, 3 squares, hot showers, a roof over ones head, heat in winter and at least a fan in summer
of which utilities you don't have to pay an arm & a leg for

(not to mention complete medical *including* dental!)

over the prospect of being destitute; living out of a car on on the streets,

there's a BIG problem in this country\


edit: Reading the comments after yours, one voice I think mentioned free education -- a GED or college, and that's considered your full time job!
& I had a family member incarcerated under Reagans-to-the-present-Pres' War. On. Drugs.
he got himself a nice Bachelors, this guy who had gotten a GED *after* he served in Nam (where he first picked up drugs, but he wasn't an addict -- just a recreational user. But nevertheless it was 'thanks for your service, you're busted!')

[texshelters]

22. More out of touch elites--this from John Boehner

http://texshelters.wordpress.com/2010/12/03/memo-from-the-desk-of-john-boehner-a-sheltersleaks-production/

Peace,
TexShelters

[nadinbrzezinski]

24. It is instructive to look at the early poor laws in England

Well before Calvin. The language was very similar blaming the poor, before Calvin by the way.

[inna]

104. We've regressed as a society, haven't we.

Seems like we're rapidly devolving right now. :shrug: :(

[donco6]

36. Even "retrained" folks can't find work.

There's no guarantee after thousands of dollars of schooling that you're going to find anything. And tuition is going upupup thanks to state budget cuts.

[KharmaTrain]

37. Even With Retraning

Few companies would want to hire a 40 or 50-something person with dependents than a young kid who will work more hours for less money. Recently I spoke with a lifelong friend...top of his class in High School who first went into teaching at the time when districts were downsizing and "retrained" (two extra years of college...not grad school...just a second major) to go into corporate communications only to have his company be bought out by a larger competitor and he was squeezed out...and then "retrained" again to get certified to work in public relations and once again found himself on the outs. Ain't as simple as it sounds and there will come a time some young thing will come along and Contessa will be hoping to get a job in Roast Beef, Indiana.

[Blue_In_AK]

38. I used to work in corrections,

and it's a fact that many of the inmates I knew would commit some petty crime or break their probation in the fall so they would be off Anchorage's cold streets in the winter. I'm certainly not suggesting this for all homeless, but I certainly understand the logic.

[AnArmyVeteran]

52. I've heard stories of sick people committing crimes to get medical care.

[demodonkey]

55. "The Cop and the Anthem"

http://www.literaturecollection.com/a/o_henry/32/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cop_and_the_Anthem

[AnArmyVeteran]

57. Thanks, I love O'Henry stories, especially The Gift of the Magi and the Last Leaf.

[demodonkey]

59. Me too. O. Henry died 100 years ago this summer, but his stories still hold true... nt

:-)

[NNN0LHI]

65. Used to have the same guy throw a garbage can into the same grocery store window every fall

Thats when I was a little kid in the 1960's so I don't think this is a new concept.

Don

[Dr.Phool]

121. We had an old guy in St. Pete a couple of months ago.

He went into a bank, handed the teller a stick-up note, then went outside, sat down, and waited for the cops.

He had nowhere else to go. He told the judge, at least in jail, he'd have a place to sleep and some food.

[Cherchez la Femme]

107. Short stories have been written on that

one by O'Henry,
another, I think (it's been a loong time) by Maussapant.

In a humorous vein, but still good.


on edit: I think also it was at least touched on by Francis Bret Harte.
All magnificent writers

[Hannah Bell]

45. how do 5th generation trust-fund brats live better, more to the point.

[AnArmyVeteran]

50. I'm sick of soulless republicans and fake right wing Christians.

I've heard one conservative after another say anyone can get a job or create one, if they only wanted to. I've heard dozens of conservatives say all people need to do is move to where the jobs are. They think families can just uproot children, sell their underwater houses and just move 2,000 miles to where a job might be. 

I am sick of these soulless conservatives. Most of them profess to be Christians, but they have zero empathy or compassion for the poor or down-on-their-luck. 

I wish democratic leaders would start to condemn them for their FAKE Christianity. They should be publicly condemned for their blatant hypocrisy. Why do democrats keep giving conservatives passes on their inhuman positions? I wish democrats would bluntly condemn them and call them hypocrites and fake Christians. 

When the self professed Christian Glenn Beck spends program after program condemning the poor why aren't democrats openly condemning him and all the dunces and fake Christians who look at him like he's a holy man? Beck is making a fortune 'bearing false witness against his neighbors', but not one public figure condemns him for his obvious hypocrisy. 

I have been sick of the religious right extremists for the past 20 years. They are all frauds whose every word and action betray them as the hypocrites they are. I truly believe if Jesus returned today they would condemn everything about him. They would condemn the way he looks. They would condemn who he associated with. They would condemn him for feeding the hungry, healing the sick and lifting the spirits of the downtrodden. They would call him a socialist, Marxist, Stalinist, communist and every other 'ist' in the world. They would crucify him figuratively in every way they could. And if today's conservative 'christians' had been around when Jesus was alive they would certainly literally nail him to a cross. And if by chance Jesus was pulled off the cross before he died today's conservative Christians would stand around his dying body condemning him for not having health insurance. Then they would belittle him until he died. 

Never in my life have I seen a more evil group of people as conservative Christians. And as time goes by they become even more evil. But no one in any leadership position is willing to confront them for their attacks against their fellow man. 

If Satan wanted to recruit people to his side all he would have to do is reveal the heartlessness of a typical conservative 'christian'. There is no better example of evil than from those who profess to be the opposite of that which the 'say' they are against. 

No one can be a practicing Christian and a conservative at the same time. They are opposites of each other. It's time they are all exposed for their evil hypocrisy. 

[kath]

119. + a brazillion. I'm also sick to death of the hateful evil conservatives who call themselves

"Christian".
Fantastic post.

[mmonk]

51. A sad commentary on this country, isn't it?

[Jack Sprat]

60. We've been saying that since forever.

It is outrageous that hardened criminals have the basic needs of food and shelter met, but the homeless are left to the elements.

[mstinamotorcity]

64. Most people who have

lucrative incomes are out of touch. When you look at people you see on television you must look at the profession they hold. If they are broadcast journalist,they usually hang out with other broadcast journalist. If they are television personalities,they hang out with other television personalities. If they are politicians they hang out with politicians. Most people hang out with people who are in their line of work. Actors who hang out with actors.Thieves who hang out with other thieves.Just how it is. So when you look at how much of their day it takes to do their profession and if they have a family,and get some sleep,just when do they get time to be around average people.And as for the people in prison its the old work force at work http://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=AtgVnfvu5t_TcxFaApeuXn.bvZx4?p=origins+of+convict+leasing&toggle=1&cop=mss&ei=UTF-8&fr=yfp-t-312 They must keep their non pay work force intact. Its the old runaway slave mentality. They institutionalize their minds and work them all day for about $1.15 cents. And they figure if they keep us out of work long enough we will cry uncle and take the sub standard wages because of desperation. They are keeping the profits and still outsourcing jobs.You know what I think.

TOMBStone

[JDPriestly]

83. As a poor person, I can't really be friends with very wealthy people.

I would be embarrassed to invite them to my house in my neighborhood. Believe me, I tried it in the past. It did not work out. Wealthy people are uncomfortable in the homes of the poor. That is why they have no idea how the rest of society lives.

"Most people who have lucrative incomes are out of touch."

Truer words were never spoken.

[Cherchez la Femme]

109. I wouldn't think there were many, if any,

ultra-rich that would willingly associate with the lower classes,
i.e. the poor.

Heck if they even had a conscience it would be troubled, & why would they WANT to trouble their beautiful minds?
They'll want to forget it, and going out on the yacht is a perfect way,
even living behind those gates in their special communities

or The Hamptons, or Newport, or Miami, or Palm Beach, or...

Heck, if they're rich enough, they'll have their own personal security -- why not?
At least it'll keep the riff-raff away


:puke:

[JDPriestly]

110. Precisely. Two Americas.

[mstinamotorcity]

133. You are not poor!!!!!!!!

Please Stop thinking in that frame of mind. Do not judge yourself by what others have!!!!!!!To admit to not being wealthy gives you something I see in very few people....CHARACTER!!!!Just because you don't live in a big home with servants or big tall fences as if to block out the undesirables of life,you are part of a community and are of GREAT value to those you love and those who love you!!!!!

[eilen]

159. I saw this documentary on lottery winners once

And there was this one family who won millions. They were bummed out their friends no longer felt comfortable around them and concluded their friends were jealous. They moved from their home to some godawful Florida gated community to be around other rich people--they dramatically changed their lifestyle. The husband quit his job to "manage" their fortune and the wife did "charity" work.

Their friends said yeah," we're kind of jealous because ultimately, the lottery winners didn't do anything more than we do to deserve their windfall" however, they were happy for them. They were glad someone they knew got lucky. However, they felt they had little in common with them anymore. They had different problems and did not feel empathy for the newly wealthy when they complained about others and their new "high class problems."

The newly rich basically just ditched their old friends for good because they could not deal or relate with them anymore. I think they felt a little guilty and defensive.

Then there were other winners who were torn apart by greedy relatives and friends or became insanely paranoid and drove the people that cared about them away. Having too much money can cause pathology. Maybe it is a windfall effect.

I have sat in the homes of people of all income levels. The only ones I was uncomfortable in were those that reeked of cigarette and animal feces/urine and those that were overwhelmed with clutter and filth. Those homes occurred among all levels. I grew up in what is considered lower middle class (all my parents were white collar) and am basically working class now-- my dh is blue collar and I guess I am pink-- a nurse -- we don't work we don't get paid... ever.

[Arkansas Granny]

67. I'd like to know where are all these jobs that people can retrain for.

I can't think of any field, right off the top of my head, that is begging for trained workers right now.

[okieinpain]

69. this might sound cruel, but i've never understood people who

aren't constantly upgrading their skills. I'm constantly taking a class or two, i mean you even get to write off a thousand bucks a year for continuing education (well that might be going away). I see people hanging up pictures of their kids and decorating their cubies and it's just a mystery why people do that stuff. the man only needs you when he needs you, other then that you're just a drain on his money, well unless you have large breast.

I don't mean to be cruel but some of this out of work/homeless/ stuff is really ridiculous. I just found out a couple of weeks ago that my sister is paying 1800 dollars a month on rent. that is freakin crazy man, she makes a good check but damn man 1800 a month for the next 30 years, that's crazy.

[haele]

73. Retraining for a new career is not the same as upgrading one's skills -

Since the kidlet is now almost officially an adult, has a part-time job, and hopefully won't cost us that much anymore, I'm taking the "savings" from raising a troubled teenager and going back to school to get the degree I never finished. I've worked, and worked hard, pretty much all my life, and had very little time to do much more than upgrade my skills - an online "refresher course", a three day class here, a one-week class there, when I had permission from my employer to do so. But to carry even two or three courses a semester for two or three years on the hopes that it won't interfere with either work or family responsibilities - ooof, that's a hard thing to consider, especially the older and more stressed out one gets.

It's actually easy enough to keep abreast of new processes and technology. It's a bit more difficult to go back to school and retrain for a new career, especially when you're still working.

The last time I was unemployed (late 1990's), it was only for a couple months; I didn't have time to retrain, I was too busy pounding pavement and nursing my networks to pick up part-time work and looking for a new employer for about 50 hours each week I was unemployed.

Also, there is the stigma of "in hindsight, making the wrong choice" - which I've always found to be a crock, because other than leveraging your trust fund into a valueless niche "job" like surfing bum, most people pick training for a career they think they have a future in (IT comes to mind - that was the new frontier in the 80's pre-NAFTA), or start right in working at what they're capable of picking up quickly with little education - like retail, or insurance.

There's a few things that I've learned to be true over the past 40 years of working - and having a friend that did a stint in HR working in hiring and employee evaluations -

- there are really very few jobs where you're going to be rich or in charge, no matter if you have your own business or work for someone. No matter what the TV says.

- most jobs can be done by anyone with half a brain. That's why HR has a checklist when they take in resumes and do interviews; to narrow the field down into a manageable amount of applicants.

- most jobs that pay more than a basic living wage are filled by people who knew someone to get the job in the first place.

- the first guy with the resume that hits all points on the checklist and can convince the hiring person that they'd be a "right fit" to work with the manager gets hired - that is, if there wasn't someone already in mind before before the job was advertised.

- if you are unemployed, most employers wonder how much of that was "your fault" when considering hiring you. Do they want to chance that you won't work out "here" like you didn't work out there.

- Looking for work that pays similar to what you lost or is in the same field you have experience in when you're unemployed is a full-time job in itself.

-take a lower paying job to get by on, you'll very rarely ever get back to your level of employment (see above). Starting back on the ground floor at a new career or job gets harder the older you get and the more responsibilities you have.

- most small start-ups will fail without a major source of funding to keep them going for the first five years, and in the field you had a career in, the majority of employers in that career field are usually looking for someone who will cost them less to do the same job you used to do.

- Experience and training actually mean very little, unless it's a requirement to meet a customer's contract. But you usually can't stand in line for a supervisory or management position (when one eventually opens up) unless you have both a reputation(as in, you are known by someone associated with the company or position) and a degree in something - even if it isn't directly related to the type of field the position is in.

- Since 2002, there has pretty much been a minimum average of 10 people applying for every job opening, from seasonal retail into high-tech or education-based fields. Even considering that half that ten might currently be working and looking for something better, that tells us that there are just not enough jobs for people who want to work, no matter what career field they are in.

YMMV, of course, but it comes down to how heroic do we expect normal, everyday people to act when faced with a situation so out of their control? Just to enforce a meme that "it's all your fault" if you can't find suitable, sustainable means to survive.

The risk of losing my job still scares the hell out of me - and I'm lucky enough to currently be working for a customer who has indicated time and time again that they need me to work for them and would bend over backwards to keep me employed.

I'm also smart enough to realize that if the economy goes south far enough, I'd still be cut to keep my current employer afloat, or if we lose our contract. And at 51+, even with a degree, the chances of me finding new employment quickly if I get a pink-slip is pretty much 20%. I'll be one of the 99'ers, stressing, but still looking...

It's so bad out there in the several different Engineering disciplines I can qualify for, I actually hope that I kick the bucket before I ever get let go before I'm 60 and eligible for my full Reservist's retirement. That way, my family could get about my company provided death and dismemberment insurance of around $500K to keep them going until they can start getting survivor's benefits off me.

Haele

[okieinpain]

123. I understand all too well, at my age I'm pretty sure that if I'm let

go I'm not going to get hired by anyone so it's going to be pretty much start my own business or work for a temporary agency. I'm just saying how people get comfortable with a job and expect that if they do good or excellent work that they will keep that job. I've been unemployed before and that was an eye-opener.

[WinkyDink]

135. "start my own business "-----BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! How young ARE you?!

[okieinpain]

165. well what the hell else are you going to do. sit around and wait

on the weak, spineless, president obama. yeah I can survive if and when i have too, even if it comes down to bartering with folks.

[WinkyDink]

134. Your post lacks coherence. 1.) Do you have a PAYCHECK, perhaps, that allows you TUITION ? 2.) Do you

REALLY not grasp the concept of trying to make a soulless cubicle LESS of one?

3.) What has your EMPLOYED sister's RENT got to do with "this out of work/homeless/ stuff"??

FAIL.

[eilen]

162. High Rent

can be a big reason to be homeless if suddenly unemployed. She could be renting for far less and saving her money or using it to invest in herself or other income streams. If you are employed, it is smart to keep your overhead expenses low. Invest your money in yourself, not your landlord's retirement.

Re: the cubicle. Well, some people are minimalists. It is a good idea to keep in mind your cubicle is not your room -- it belongs to your employer. I would not bring that much of myself into that kind of work environment. I work in a hospital and we wear the same color uniforms and the only thing that really changes is the faces in the rooms and the paperwork. We are paid by the hour. I don't provide any more information that I have to that can influence my employer one way or the other to terminate my employment. Next year I will be living in a right to fire for no cause state and I will continue to keep my personal preferences and taste under the radar. Ultimately all we are living breathing licenses to our employers, easily enough to replace with a brand new one.

At my job, we have no spaces like cubicles. We have a nurse's station/pod but it is strictly utilitarian. There are a few who put pictures on their lockers. However our profession has a high turnover rate d/t the nature of the work and the stress. One thing we do that is more personal is have days where we bring in food and plan occasional outings for staff but there are always staff that can't come because they have to work. Most of the time it is a group of young 20-somethings that meet out for drinks. We don't have a shortage of overtime hours either. You are better off tending to patients, raking in the OT and putting it away than socializing with other staff. If you do that you are more likely to get leave to attend different core classes to make you more valuable and transfer to a better work environment that can give you other bonus pay options.

[okieinpain]

163. sure i have a paycheck, and instead of buying a new car that

cost $500 to $600 a month. I take my ass back to class every year. I mention my sisters rent because I can't believe that she would go and get herself into a monthly bill that is that high. she makes good money but I truly doubt that she's making that much. it makes me wonder when I see folks tooling around in there new cars, and staying in these really nice houses around here are living month to month.

i'm just wondering how many people have gone out trying to live the american dream and have gotten themselves into the american nightmare.

[Lucian]

70. I saw that earlier today and I couldn't believe at how stupid of a question it was then.

And how dumber it is now that I'm re-reading it. The woman interviewed made a valid point: how is she supposed to retrain for a job when she can't afford to live from day to day. The lack of empathy in Washington, DC and in the media is appalling.

[sarcasmo]

74. Work camps for the unemployed will the next step. All in the name of the Homeland.

[StarsInHerHair]

75. recc'd best comparison yet why do prisoners have it better?

nt

[Desertrose]

100. Yep..that was my comment.

How bad is it for folks when prisoners lives look "better"?

What the hell does that say about us???


Welcome to DU StarsInHerHair :)

[bertman]

79. Do any of these talking heads make less than $250,000 a year?

Excellent post. Rec.

[Axle_techie]

86. +1

[nvme]

92. K& R

[barbtries]

106. as a nation

we are ill, very sick. i don't know how this turns out. i think turning off the tv would be a good start.

[defendandprotect]

112. Consider that those pushing our shiny new prison industrial complex ....

are always looking for new occupants -- think it's something like $50,000 a year

per prisoner? --

They seem to have been leaning towards making homelessness and poverty illegal for

a decade or more now!!

They'll get around to her!!


:evilgrin:

[MrMickeysMom]

113. The point is... retrain for WHAT?

Even if she turned to working 3 jobs and taking a course one credit at a time, where can that training lead to?

Maslow would turn over in the grave.

[farmboxer]

116. Obama & Republicans do not care

Obama always talks about how to to please Republicans, never Democrats. He does not care about "We The People". I will vote for Obama in 2012, but after I do I will puke! Millionaires and Republicans mean something, the poor/middleclass are helpless, We are the victims. We have no power, but if, some way, we could all get together and march on Washington, and afterward vote, we could get somebody's attention.

[eilen]

166. I don't see much of a difference today

and 5 years ago except there are more unemployed. But we have been leaking jobs steadily every year. Things in this country have been going to shit since I was born --it hasn't gotten any better other than for the few that benefit from whatever bubble was blowing up and I don't think that it makes much of a difference who is president.

We are halfway through a Democratic president and look! Still in 2 wars. He has actually requested more money in the defense budget than his predecessor. Look! SS still threatened. Look! Education even more fucked up. More people out of work, more jobs incentified to move overseas, actively engaging in more war fronts, less privacy, worse airport travel ever.

The hijinks in Congress are theater.

[quaker bill]

124. I am not sure

the folks in prison would agree they are better off. I think most would prefer to be homeless but out of prison, which is why they use guards and bars to keep them in. Just say'n.

I do agree that prisoners can count on meals, some heat, and a roof over their heads.

[Enthusiast]

125. But we have freedom!

:sarcasm:

[Anakin Skywalker]

128. Most of the damn jobs are overseas now!

All that remain are "service jobs" where you are paid minimum wage while the rich @$$holes (the very same ones who shipped your jobs overseas to begin with) in their Mercedes and Beemers treat you rudely out of contempt for your lowly positions.

Believe that, playa!

[B Calm]

129. And the republicans want to give the rich bastards who sent our jobs

away another big tax cut!

[WinkyDink]

132. Every Christmas, Red Skelton would portray a homeless man who committed petty theft to be sent to

jail, for the very reasons stated by that woman.

The RS Hour was in the 1950's.

Progress.

[MrObama]

137. I have a question about unemployment benefits in US

Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unemployment_benefits#Eligibility_and_amount

"The average weekly payment is 36 percent of the individual's average weekly wage."

Is this true? 36%? Is this a typo?

[WinkyDink]

138. It depends.

http://www.policyalmanac.org/social_welfare/archive/unemployment_compensation.shtml

[fasttense]

139. Probably it is not a typo.

When we were receiving unemployment my husband was getting less than 25% of what he made before they did away with his job. So, considering that 36% is an average, it is probably correct.

[MrObama]

152. Oh My Goddess... I was getting 80% last year but i still think it's too low!

It should be 90% like in Denmark... :-(

[SemperEadem]

142. one will always have an idiot like contessa brewer asking stupid questions

because contessa brewer has never had a day without money in her bank accounts. If she ever had, that question would not have come out of her mouth because she would know that while you are training, you get no income. Exactly just who is supposed to step up and pay their bills? Their family and friends? What makes contessa brewer think that they must have a clutch of multi-millionares as friends that they won't tap?

one asks or doesn't ask question based directly on their own experience. You can't expect one who has never been demoralizingly unemployed to understand just how boorish and oafish she sounds by asking such a breathtakingly stupid question. Bravo for this woman to push back on ignorance.

Change that "O" to a "U" in her first name and that pretty much sums her up.

[irislake]

143. Cheer up, things will get better.

wait till they bring back the troops from all your 100 or so military bases around the world because you can't afford them any more and empty the jails because you can't afford them either.

On the other hand looks like they have had the foresight to build a whole lot of internment camps to house folk who are unhappy with the government. Wonder how they can afford them.

Hmmmm.

[CanonRay]

145. Are there no prisons? Are there no workhouses?

[DonCoquixote]

146. Sad but true story

Of course, I live in Florida. I worked for the department of Corrections for a brief bit. Now, of course, we took a "tour" of the cell blocks. Now, I looked, and found that they were built just like my college dorms, except they had fresher coats of paint, and an Insta-Hot water heater for Ramen noodles, something we asked for in my old dorm, but were told we could not get.

Now, not that Florida prisons are great, but keep in mind, I was repaying my student loans, and had NO insurance, whereas the prisoners had full dental, full medical, and better dorms than the college whose 30k in student loans debt I had yet to repay.

[vssmith]

149. Some politicians in this country are EVIL

[newtothegame]

150. We can thank Repubs for the unemployment situation, but we can thank ourselves...

for the comfortable existence we've created for some of the world's worst criminals. What's heartbreaking is to see victim's families living in poverty from legal costs, while the murderer of their loved one sleeps warm at night and enjoys cable and 3 hearty meals a day in prison.

[BrklynLiberal]

151. Yep. Prisoners are required by law to have access to at least SOME medical care.

and many of the other "entitlements" that out of work non-offenders cannot get...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=9658197

[KingOfLostSouls]

154. exactly

part of starving the beast is destroying the ability for more people to have upward mobility and to simply be cheap labor without options to move, produce, or own.

without federal grants, subsidies, or programs, it limits people's options and keeps them locked into a path of misery instead of giving them the tools and opportunity to retrain and find a new pathway to success. it gives people either starve or don't starve.

that is not opportunity. people who are committed to finding new work and retraining should be able to have those needs met, yet we're supposed to cut that kinda spending or never build on it so eric cantor can get a tax cut.

[Goldstein1984]

156. It will take another Charles Dickens to tell the story of our time

How long before I check the news and find coverage of cities burning?

[lonestarnot]

157. K & R!

[ProfessionalLeftist]

158. short-sighted asshattery from corprat-owned media wonks

Why am I not surprised.

Speaking of 'training' for jobs in another field: It does NO GOOD to train for jobs that DON'T EXIST. As for the few jobs that do exist: You don't have to 'train' to be a dishwasher or Wal-Mart greeter. That corprats are demanding college degrees for even these low-paying service jobs is irrelevant. You don't need a college degree to scrub dishes or stand at a store entrance.

That 'training' argument is pure bullshit and they know it.

[JEB]

160. Trickle down

from the tax cuts. Works like a charm. Things are not going to change until the corporations begin to feel the squeeze. I suggest buying nothing this season.

[femrap]

167. I was thinking the same thing

yesterday. I think I'll go visit a women's prison and see how it is. I could find an organization that helps women in prisons and kill 2 'assholes' with one stone.

I don't kill birds.

[earcandle]

169. Prisons for Profit ? Sick, isn't it?