We're all Republicans now.

[Octafish]

FTR: Not how I really feel, but how it seems...



If you're for Social Security, you're not in tune with being a modern Democrat.

If you're for justice for Gov. Don Siegelman and Richard Scrushy, you're not in tune with being a modern Democrat.

If you're for government creating jobs for the jobless, you're not in tune with being a modern Democrat.

If you're for taxing Wall Street and the rich, you're not in tune with being a modern Democrat.

If you're for protecting the environment for future generations, you're not in tune with being a modern Democrat.

If you're for peace in Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Somalia, Yemen and any place else, you're not in tune with being a modern Democrat.

If you're for creating a New Deal for the 21st Century, you're not in tune with being a modern Democrat.

If you're for any of those things, you're no longer really a Democrat at all. You're a leftist, as "Left" means Socialist. And Republicans won't have that.

So call me a commie or a socialist or an old-time Democrat -- I don't care. Just don't call me a "modern Democrat" or Republican.

[polichick]

1. Rephrase: THEY'RE all Republicans now. Time for principled Dems...

...to do something about it.

[Johonny]

10. +1

[truebrit71]

25. Amen....

...but what, and how?

[polichick]

27. The only thing I can think of is for progressive groups - and there are many - to unite...

...to pressure the powers-that-be, and/or to draft a primary challenger, and/or to start a new party.

Progressives need to launch an innovative messenging effort because, when issues are presented without labels, most Americans are progressive. Our government hasn't represented the people in a long time now, no matter which party is in power.

[dotymed]

96. polichick, that is one of the few ways that we

can possibly get out of this mess that has become our government. Please be careful, my op was "locked" the other day for suggesting the same thing.

When our only two "viable" political parties are corporate owned and operated, it is up to the people to start all over. We can't give up without a fight and a real Progressive party, with Real Progressives at the helm, would be the party of the new deal. Just like real Democrats are.

[StarsInHerHair]

60. look here, I'm an FDR Democrat

http://fdrdemocrats.org/

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

30. There's nothing we can do. You have as your siggie, vote out the corporate whores.

The problem is, they're the ones with the money. They're the ones that have the millions of dollars to spend on campaigns ergo, they will have the money to win and keep this vicious cycle going. We have achieved Catch-22 status. The only way to break free is with true campaign finance and lobbying reform, but those who are in power would never vote for that as long as they have their cash cows..... in other words, we are royally fucked.

[socialist_n_TN]

36. So what do you do about it?

Give up? Suicide? Join the fascists?

[Vanje]

57. Tune in

Turn on.
Drop out.

This aint my game anymore.

[The Big Vetolski]

62. Wait. You'll know when the time is right. It will be obvious.

The Visigoths are inside the borders of the Empire, still wanting to be good citizens and only wanting to share in the fruits of the Empire. And being mercilessly exploited by the Imperial aristocracy. Everyone says if they revolt they have no chance.

And then came Adrianople. I wonder where our Adrianople is?

[Jackpine Radical]

65. We're all Visigoths now.

[Octafish]

38. Excellent edit.

I'm all for a big tent and all, but really. I should have written it in a way that makes clear what I want is for all Democrats in it to hold and follow certain principles. Taking the side of the powerful over the common person isn't one of them.

[peace frog]

108. Well past time for them to do something...but will they?

One or two might try, only to be ignored and/or shut down by the remaining DINOs.

[russspeakeasy]

114. "principled Dems" ..who are they? where are they hiding?

[woo me with science]

122. +1

[FiveGoodMen]

2. Ain't that the truth!

[Octafish]

39. If you're for Unions ahead of management...

...you're not in tune with being a modern Democrat.

That's not what I believe, either. Yet, that's what we're seeing in the public sector, from state departments of education to the National Park Service.

[xchrom]

3. Indeed. Nt

[Octafish]

48. If you believe Civil Rights are fundamental to ALL Americans...

...you're not in tune with being a modern Democrat.

[awoke_in_2003]

121. very key point...

it surprises me how many here support the "separate but equal" (civil union) idea.

[OHdem10]

4. you are not alone.

[Octafish]

49. It's like somebody who's not a Democrat is leading my Party toward being GOP-lite or worse...

...GOP-2. And that is not acceptable in any way, shape, or form.

[Vanje]

58. "Lite"?

Nothing lite about it.

[Jackpine Radical]

67. I guess "lite" means that they're corporate Republicans, not

Cultural Conservatives. Let people screw who they want, worship as they wish, etc., as long as it doesn't cut into corporate profits.

[ckimmy57]

116. My thoughts

EXACTLY

[mzmolly]

5. Another old time Democrat

here.

:kick:

[Octafish]

50. If you believe the only thing we have to fear is fear itself...

...you're not in tune with being a modern Democrat.

Gosh. I really do remember when that was true.

[Big Blue Marble]

6. We, as in we out here, are going to have to face

the stark reality, we currently have no representation in government. What
little we had in the past has been stolen from us. The Democratic Party that
so many are committed to supporting no longer exists. And neither does
representative government, at least not for those of us out here,

[Octafish]

52. All that hard work -- going, going and almost all gone.

Now we must scoop up the pieces and start anew.

Those who want to stand with us and build a better future,
the kind made possible through Democratic values,
let's get busy.

Those who want to do what the pukes want
should go stand with the pukes.

As to what should be Item 1 on the Agenda: End Secret Government,
meaning no more USA PATRIOT Act, Secret Team, Secret Court, Secret War, Capitalism's Invisible Army for Wall Street, Superduper Spy on America Nutwork.

Then, once we know what's what and who's who, we can get on with the business of straightening out the rest of the GOP mess.

[Melissa G]

55. We need to start with No More Secret Elections or we are never

going to get anywhere.

[HomerRamone]

77. Amen nt

[alsame]

7. What are the principles of Democrats now? What are the

third rails? What are the lines they won't cross?

The GOP have very strong and solid principles, even though they are destructive to the country and the average American. They have issues on which they simply will not compromise.

On what issues will Democrats fight as fiercely as the GOP does for tax cuts?

[katnapped]

14. Can't hurt the rich!

That's the third rail now.

MUST...BE...PROTECTED!

[alsame]

22. They're not 'rich'...they're all 'job creators' now. nt

[larwdem]

64. True

[defendandprotect]

69. Return to child labor in America --

[hifiguy]

8. That

x1000.

[fivepennies]

9. Not republicans,

we're all Indians now.



Obama's Indian problem

"This is about how defeated our people feel. There's hopelessness out there," Two Bulls tells me later. "People across the United States don't realise we could be identified as the third world. Our living conditions, what we have to live with, what we have to make do with. People think we are living high off the hog on welfare and casinos. I've asked them – US congressional people, US secretaries of these departments who deal with us – come out to our reservation, see firsthand how we live, why we live that way. Find out why our children are killing themselves. Learn who we are."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/global/2010/jan/11/native-americans-reservations-poverty-obama

[BOG PERSON]

13. “It looks like we're in trouble, Tonto."

“What do you mean 'we,' white man?”

[fivepennies]

18. We:

Mitakuye Oyasin: We Are All Related (Lakota saying)

[AsahinaKimi]

37. Kizuna...

きずな Kizuna. It means the strong loving connection between each other!

[fivepennies]

43. The problems arise

when people get the idea that "each other" means only those who look like them and talk like them and dress like them and think like them and ... well, you get the picture. I guess they figure we'll be so much better off if we all hang (or starve) separately.

[Enthusiast]

89. I've been saying this

for some time now.

[fivepennies]

115. Me too.

The settlers of old were simply the bulldozers of the monied elite, pushing ever westward and mowing down the opposition as they went, opening new avenues of expansion and wealth to be exploited by the select few. The settlers understandably had needs, too, but they didn't realize how they were being used for a much larger purpose.

The same is true with people of today and now that there's nowhere left for the elites to expand, all that's left is to mow down the "new" opposition in every corner of the world so as to consolidate their control over every blade of grass that grows and every thing that has a heartbeat.

Call them corporatists or call them Republicans or just call them filthy bastards, it doesn't matter. They won.

I'm just not sure which has been their most potent tool, the paperwork (titles, deeds, treaties, laws), or fools with guns, although I suspect it might be the former.

[Enthusiast]

117. After reading

Allan W Eckert's books I have come to the same conclusion about the settlers. The settlers were just pawns in the ever Westward push. They served the purpose of helping to push the natives from their land. I remember reading Allan's account of the earliest white men that moved into Kentucky, men like Daniel Boone. The first ones there made land claims but subsequently lost these claims to the 'legitimate' paperwork of the monied elite. It's kind of an unspoken system. Apparently we are still employing this 'system' today. We are all the Indians now.

[fivepennies]

123. The Homestead Act

Unintended results (or not unintended)

Fourth, the federal government in the nineteenth century lacked the personnel to adequately run the land offices. Enforcement officials were over-whelmed. This of course gave rise to cheating. Speculators, monopolists, and others used the land laws to create giant farms. So instead of the Homestead Act promoting small farms, it ended up promoting the large western ranch. Of the some 1 billion acres of public land that the government owned in the nineteenth century, 183 million acres went to railroad corporations; 140 million acres to the states; 100 million acres to Indian tribes; and 100 million acres to free farmers (the total acreage given out in cash sales). (One half of the land had not been sold because it had been reserved for national parks or was totally unsuited for agricultural development.)

So only one acre in five that the government released out of its hands went to small farmers—

http://www.enotes.com/major-acts-congress/homestead-act

The railroads alone got almost twice the amount of land as was "given" to the original owners of it all and the people congress said the Act was supposed to help got bilked, too. So now, according to the paperwork, it all belongs to the bankers and Wall street speculators and insiders. And you can bet the farm that they'll bring out the fools with guns if we get too uppity about it.

[Enthusiast]

125. Thanks.

Interesting.

[WillyT]

11. Can I At Least Be A Rockefeller Republican ???

:evilgrin:

:yoiks:

:kick: & Rec!!!

[DocMac]

16. No...only keystone light republicans need apply.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

12. I'm in, too!!! n/t

[bobthedrummer]

15. WISCONSIN is OPEN for BUSINESS-SEIG HEIL!!! k&r, N/T

[damntexdem]

17. I'm not, and I won't vote for a party that is -- whatever it calls itself.

There may be nowhere to go, but we can still try to go there -- preferable to staying in a Repuke/DINO here. ;-)

[DirkGently]

19. Our mode of capitalist extremism will implode just like Soviet communism. Then what'll we say?

[BOG PERSON]

20. soviet communism didn't implode until it became something different

i.e. until perestroika (restructuring), the horror stories about shortages and crippling inefficiency were gravely exaggerated.

[DirkGently]

28. Right. It was so great you weren't allowed leave. They failed. We're failing. Time to be honest.

[BOG PERSON]

31. no, it's 100% true

soviet communism was salvageable (a corrupt and unaccountable party apparatus notwithstanding) until the government introduced economic "restructuring" that took its inspiration from european social-democracy.

[mojowork_n]

40. In hindsight, that's....

...putting the cart before the horse.

The economic "re-structuring" following a looser model came after a decade of economic warfare, where the U.S. had corralled all of
its allies to work together to try and undercut the world prices for commodities on which the U.S.S.R. depended.

From oil, to timber, to you name it. The Saudi's obligingly pumped more -- so the Russians would be paid less.

It worked.

Perestroika came after, as a belated way to try and respond to a suddenly much-diminished account balance in the National Treasury.

[socialist_n_TN]

41. This was just another front in the war

that the capitalists fought against the USSR from it's FOUNDING. It was nothing really new. Maybe a little more enthusiastic under Reagan than the previous 40 years or so, but only different in degree, not in kind.

[mojowork_n]

61. And no different than what they've been trying to do to Cuba.

I'm in complete agreement on that point -- on an overall political/military/ideological level -- not much had changed,
as nothing much has changed in the relationship between the U.S. and Fidel and Raul.

Reagan thought he was escalating military spending to force an effect, but Soviet military expenditures remained pretty flat.
The Berlin Wall did not fall because St. Ronnie huffed and puffed.

What changed were purely the plus and minus digits and the color of the ink on the balance sheets.

The price of oil fell. (Although possibly, it was artificially maintained at that low level for an extended period, through
oil cartel collusion.)

And that had an effect. Income declined while costs went up.

Mother Russia could no longer pay her bills. They were selling the gold they had gotten from the Loyalists after
the collapse of the Spanish Republic. (What remained of the wealth plundered from Peru and Mexico and the rest of
Latin America.)

Do you remember the massive fire sale of any and all commodity assets that followed, under Yeltsin?

...Anyway, that's what I'm saying. It might not have been the sole, fatal dagger blow -- whatever that could have been -- but
the economy was severely malnourished. And right after that came the collapse; the C.I.S., the whole sorry sequence of events that
followed.

Recovery in Russia started when oil prices started to go back up, and investment funds became available to make oil
extraction more productive.

I read it somewhere else first and of course I can't find what I read, but these guys say pretty much the same thing:

http://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/Peak-Oil-and-the-Collapse-of-the-Soviet-Union.html

Remember 2008, here, when oil prices fell of a cliff? Something similar happened to the boys in the Kremlin, but they couldn't
print enough rubles anyone would want to buy.

[defendandprotect]

74. US conspired to "bait the Russians into Afghanistan" ... US went in 6 months before Russia ...

. . . they wanted to bait Russia in . . . "in hopes of giving them a Vietnam-type

experience" -- Bzrezinski/Carter administration


How sick are the people running our country?

[defendandprotect]

72. J. Edgar Hoover always called it "totalitarian" communism .....

and from what I've read you're correct -- the horror stories were for our

benefit --

and as soon as the wall fell, elites here didn't need a middle class any longer!

All theater --

[defendandprotect]

71. +1 -- Think we need to toss capitalism BEFORE our country is sold as Greece is being sold ...

We need to think along the lines of uninventing the dollar --

an artificial instrument which just shifts power from the people to the few elites.

What was it the Native American said about the dollar -- and very poetically ...

Something like - "You can't plant a dollar bill" -- "You can't eat a dollar bill" --

"If you stare at it it will not show you a sunrise" --


They made sense -- we made a mess!!


:)

[Me.]

21. KR

[amborin]

23. kr

[dissidentboomer]

24. Yeah, I know. Me too. The last decade has been like

watching a train wreck in slow motion.

[sabrina 1]

26. Yes, it seems that at least those we elected are, except for a very

few.

[Odin2005]

29. Nader was right. Nader was FUCKING RIGHT.

[Name removed]

34. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Vanje]

59. can't STAND that asshole . , ..but

Yeah. Nader was right.

[Hubert Flottz]

32. Not ish...

I won't be reCONstructed!

[slay]

33. I'm with you buddy

these current Dems are bullshit and stand for nothing.

[dotymed]

100. IMO, they do stand for something.

Money and power in a crumbling empire. Too bad they no longer stand for the people.

How shortsighted these politicians are.

How ignorant and uninformed Americans have become every since THE FAIRNESS DOCTRINE was revoked.

Seriously, a POTUS candidate that said: "My goal, after turning this economy around, with living wage jobs....,will be the restoration of an updated Fairness Doctrine. I believe that only a well informed electorate can make crucial decisions about the future of our country." would definitely get my vote.

The repeal of, and subsequent misinformation concerning that very important rule, for over 30 years, proves the ignorance of our population.

[tekisui]

35. We have yet to overcome or answer to the Raygun Revolution.

He radically changed the game, and the politicos have been playing by his rules since. We need a radical change back!

[EFerrari]

47. The leadership's answer to Reagan was to try to cut themselves in.

That was their response and it's working out very well for them.

[Octafish]

53. Some Democrats chose to ignore the crimes of Pruneface and Poppy and look where it's got them.

A place at the table and an invite to the redoubt in Paraguay, I imagine.
There's enough food and water there to last out the rapidly approaching big thinning of the herd.

[EFerrari]

54. Yes, and by now, ignoring crimes is just how DC rolls.

[Enthusiast]

90. That is real affection.

We do not see this when he interacts with leftish figures.

[Octafish]

112. Poppy on a late leftish figure, Sen. Paul Wellstone...

"Who is this chickenshit?"

[Enthusiast]

119. That says it all right there....nt

[tomp]

92. reagan made it worse....

....but the game was total bullshit before reagan, like back to the turn of the century. the basics are not new. they have perfected their power, that is, capitalism/corporatism.

[LLStarks]

42. Heh. The famous Bush/Cheney 2000 staff bumrush in Florida. Nice pic. nt

[Octafish]

98. That's exactly what it is! They gave democracy a bum's rush.

[Wilms]

44. ^

[mmonk]

45. Recommended.

One exception to the title. If you belong to one of the two major political parties, you adhere to Republican Party framing and dogma.

[WillyT]

46. Kick !!!

:kick:

[blkmusclmachine]

51. Does our Party even stand for anything anymore?

Looks like the Party Plank is for show purposes only.

[krabigirl]

87. war. nt

[leftstreet]

56. K&R

[Name removed]

63. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Octafish]

70. Guess you're an "unrecommend."

I've been fighting these assholes since I was old enough to know who's who and what's what. So I won't stand by in silence when the Democratic Party tears down what it stands for to be like them.

Oh yeah: Fuck you, too!

[Electric Monk]

73. Your dad was Frank Olson, right? THE Frank Olson? You have every right to feel the way you do.

imntsho
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Olson

or maybe I misread that somewhere along the lines... but I remember reading it somewhere.

[Octafish]

75. No, my Friend. You're thinking about another DUer who is.

I've also written on the case of Dr. Olson:

Know your BFEE: Cheney, Rumsfeld, Ford Covered Up CIA Murder of American Scientist

[Electric Monk]

78. It's ok, no need to go further on that, but I still feel like a frog in a pot.

[Art_from_Ark]

66. Happy to recommend

You've summed it up quite nicely.

[lobezen]

68. Hells yeah!!

[defendandprotect]

76. +1000% ---

One of the mysteries of life for me is that Republicans are so certain they

don't need Social Security and Medicare --

and where do all those company heads who have been knocked out by capitalist

monopoly go -- ? Do they move to some cheering section on the sidelines where

they live off their "golden parachustes" -- ?

Don't any of them feel under attack by these corporate/fascists?



Principles over party --



:)

[PatrynXX]

79. Big problem with Socialists.. Republicans can't get traction with it.

Which is why they resorted to calling the Dems Right Wing Fascists. If they pushed Socialism to much, people might actually start voting that way. (hello Sanders)

[Blue-Jay]

80. To be honest, we ARE better at shitting on Democrats.

[Octafish]

83. Ya think so?

I,for one, don't.



Know your BFEE: Nazis couldn’t win WWII, so they backed Bushes.

What's becoming clear to me is that in addition to ideology, certain common interests cross party lines, especially when it comes to real property and political power.

It'd be undemocratic and un-Democratic in every way for me not to mention it.

[Name removed]

81. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Blue-Jay]

82. Riveting tale, chap.

[Safetykitten]

84. Who woulda thunk? How did this happen?

[Initech]

85. What we're witnessing between the dems and repubs is a corporate merger.

[krabigirl]

86. to me, most politicians in both parties seem the same.

[Enthusiast]

88. I'm no filthy Republican.

Weed out the sell-outs.

[democrank]

91. K & R

Your list could have gone on and on and on



if you`re for torture
if you`re against unions
if you bash teachers
if you ignore homelessness
if you ignore Haiti
if you ignore BP spills
if you`re more willing to listen to Republicans than the Left of your own party
on and on and on

[TheUnspeakable]

93. k&r

[mazzarro]

95. I noticed that Carter was standing apart from the rest of them

And it is now obvious why that is - he is the only one rarely consulted by His Corporate Highness - President Obama. I guess that will be because Carter will give him a piece of his mind if called on. The others in that picture seemed to be chummy with each other except for Carter.

[felix_numinous]

94. The Revisionist Democratic Party

-there is a devious attempt to change the meaning of everything! It is infuriating to watch as nothing is the same when you change the LANGUAGE. How can we talk about anything with people who have been literally REPROGRAMMED to redefine WHO you are???

It is crazymaking--everything is ass backwards when WE are the ones trying to CONSERVE the original meanings of inalienable human rights, while the REVISIONISTS are calling themselves conservatives!!

This is not a matter of being old and in the way of something new and fresh. This 'New Abnormal' is stealing this country out from under us, by re education. These shifty bastards are changing our party from within, not only by physically infiltrating our ranks, but by changing how and what we are talking about.

I do not like ANYONE telling me who I am. Our party has been critically infiltrated by people who have lost the vision of who we are. I know who I am, and recognize other Democratic people--Octafish, you keep me sane even if I don't do that for you. And many others here.

I will not be rebranded.

[OwnedByFerrets]

97. Nice list

[fascisthunter]

99. Thank you.... K&R (nt)

[LynneSin]

101. Speak for yourself

nuff said

[Octafish]

106. Wouldn't dream of speaking for you -- or most anyone else for that matter.

That's why the first line is:

FTR: Not how I really feel, but how it seems...

"FTR" stands for "For The Record."

Re-reading the rest of the OP, I see several places where I could've been much more clear, as well. What I won't change is my rationale for writing it: I am steamed that what passes for the Democratic Party of today is so much different than what it was just a few years ago. Unless more of us do something about it, no one will be able to tell a Republicon from a "New Democrat."

[suffragette]

102. The chorus keeps singing their tune and we are out of tune with it

Definitely in tune with you though.

Keep singing Octafish. Be glad to join you in the song.

[felix_numinous]

103. Most of the people I know are old time Democrats

i come from a blue state and my sister worked for Social Security in DC who is able to live off civil servant benefits. My mother is living off my father's civil servant benefits and her sister worked as a civil servant, so our family is able to afford Alzheimer's care for both of them now.

The only reason my family is able to survive is because of government benefits--we were all raised to admire FDR, and my parents both admired him even though they were Republicans. They both lived through the Great Depression and grew up knowing what it was like to be hungry.

Families remember who stole from them, and who fed them--and I think it is a grave error for this administration to ally with those who are stealing from the American people.

Corporatists' attempt to rebrand the Democratic Party is dividing us--just when we need to UNIFY against the corporatists. I think it is critical that we do not allow this to happen.

Corporate disruptors are working to marginalize and ridicule those of us who are standing up for EVERYONE. We need to all stand together and not be divided. Standing our ground will STRENGTHEN the party and the country, don't let anyone tell you different.

[ieoeja]

104. I couldn't believe it when Senate and House Democrats came out in favor of gutting SSI.

Oh, wait....

:shrug:

[slipslidingaway]

105. knr nt

[_ed_]

107. Nader

was right in 2000. I know we're all supposed to hate him because Al Gore couldn't win his home state, but can anyone say that he was wrong with a straight face?

[Beam Me Up]

109. All this has been coming for years and should be no surprise to anyone here.

"The left" was given a "bad rap" and carefully marginalized politically through the last half of the previous century. To the point now where to be called "liberal" in many circles is an insult (never mind socialist or communist). This is what happens when a government gets taken over from within by a neofascist corporate/banking-military/intelligence/security-industrial/technological-complex whose sole aim is to preserve and broaden its wealth, power and control while circumscribing, assimilating, defeating and if need be destroying any perceived threat to its global hegemony. This has NOT been "politics as usual" since the installation of Bush the Second in 2000, the further installation of Obama, a white republican in black face, not withstanding. Yeah, unlike his predecessor he actually does have a clue and was actually elected, but anyone with eyes to see and ears to hear knew that the aforementioned neo-con-fascists would never allow anyone they couldn't control anywhere near the White House. So... there you have it. Welcome to the US of fucking A in the Twentyfirst god damned century.

[swilton]

110. I'm With You Octafish!

[Stargleamer]

111. Even Eisenhower Republicans. . .

are less Republican than "Modern Democrats" (well at least to some extent anyhow).

[Hell Hath No Fury]

113. I am old school and damn proud of it.

Fuck these "new Democrats". :mad:

[Evasporque]

118. YARGLE BARGLE BLARG!! nt

[awoke_in_2003]

120. too late to rec...

but here is a kick, comrade :)

[Rex]

124. I am a capitalist, but my country is owned by charlatans and war criminals.

I don't recognize the system in place today, it is beyond corrupt and no one is willing to fix it. They are all too busy lining their pockets with money. And the paymasters have endless money streams. This is not a 'free market' it is now a 'rigged market' by the biggest fish in the game.

I am NOT a Republican, I am just a lost capitalist looking for the democracy that once was America.

BUSH AND CHENEY FUCKED UP EVERYTHING...THANKS GUYS! :sarcasm: