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MillennialDem

(2,367 posts)

46. The problem with that study is it doesn't prove a gun was required to stop the

Fri Jul 8, 2016, 01:02 PM

Jul 2016

commission of a crime, let alone save a life (an even higher bar). Are you really suggesting there would be 700,000 murders per year if there were no guns? :lol:

Also, I'd need to see the data further, but many defensive gun uses are... quite ambiguous as whether they're justified or not. Is pulling a gun on someone during a road rage shouting match justified? Maybe, maybe not. If it's self reported, the gun owner will 99.999% say it was justified though. Who is going to admit "yeah, I pulled a gun, but it wasn't justified"?

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So, where were all the good guys with guns? [View all] Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 OP

There are at least tens of thousands TeddyR Jul 2016 #1

The Good Guys With Guns scenario works every time... Jerry442 Jul 2016 #4

A little research TeddyR Jul 2016 #9

There are 320 million people in this country. Jerry442 Jul 2016 #11

Perhaps TeddyR Jul 2016 #13

I guess I missed the press release from the NRA... Jerry442 Jul 2016 #15

The CDC did a study a couple of years ago Duckhunter935 Jul 2016 #42

Helps to know the full story, rather than only that part which validates your bias. LanternWaste Jul 2016 #56

Guns save thousands MattP Jul 2016 #26

Do you have any concrete evidence to support your assertion of saving thousands of lives. We do madinmaryland Jul 2016 #29

See this discussion TeddyR Jul 2016 #34

The problem with that study is it doesn't prove a gun was required to stop the MillennialDem Jul 2016 #46

Oh, I agree TeddyR Jul 2016 #51

Of course 2/3 of those are suicides Duckhunter935 Jul 2016 #43

So they don't matter, right? Way to treat people with mental illness like depression and MillennialDem Jul 2016 #47

Nope, I agree with much better mental health services Duckhunter935 Jul 2016 #49

Good, I'm glad you do. I just don't like when people brush suicides under MillennialDem Jul 2016 #50

A friend of mine hung himself last month Duckhunter935 Jul 2016 #53

I'm sorry about your friend. But again, the thing is guns are the easiest way to MillennialDem Jul 2016 #55

Suicides should not be conflated Duckhunter935 Jul 2016 #57

No, I really don't view that way (honest). If others do, I obviously can't speak for MillennialDem Jul 2016 #60

Sorry, no maxsolomon Jul 2016 #100

So, how do the Japanese "outgun" us with their suicide rate? Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #103

Very sorry to hear of the death of your friend PJMcK Jul 2016 #101

And there are many more stories of guns Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #16

Old saying: "Plural of 'anecdote' is not 'data'" Jerry442 Jul 2016 #17

Anecdotes and data. Straw Man Jul 2016 #30

This argument gets trotted out everytime there is a mass shooting Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #8

Once again people are surprised... Jerry442 Jul 2016 #14

I don't know the exact details, but if the cops had a clear shot at this guy, they frankieallen Jul 2016 #87

Interesting. Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #88

Yes, he is a coward because he shot innocent people from a distance. Apparently you disagree? frankieallen Jul 2016 #90

Let's see, Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #91

No, it isn't good enough, frankieallen Jul 2016 #94

Ah, sexist language Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #95

morally questionable? I see you are backing off your original comparison. frankieallen Jul 2016 #96

Your post needs correction: The bearing of arms is for self-defense, not for an LEO auxillary... Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #104

The the NRA and its ilk Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #107

Who needs the NRA? My reasons are sufficient. Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #113

And they don't always win, even treestar Jul 2016 #61

I know of one 3 days ago maxsolomon Jul 2016 #69

If they are like me, sitting at home with their family, guns are unloaded and stored In_The_Wind Jul 2016 #2

Well, that would describe most people Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #10

You missed the more likely reason "good guys" didn't fire back... Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #105

while I take your question as rhetorical GreatGazoo Jul 2016 #3

But they keep telling us these things can be avoided Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #6

That's what I'm saying --more guns equals more death GreatGazoo Jul 2016 #19

isn't that what the police are supposed to be? rurallib Jul 2016 #5

The NRA and 2nd Amendment Absolutists Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #7

This conceal carry permit holder would have fled the fuck out of there... Marengo Jul 2016 #12

Likewise. Lizzie Poppet Jul 2016 #22

Exactly right Duckhunter935 Jul 2016 #45

Stupid thread IMHO. greytdemocrat Jul 2016 #18

Yes, and we see it "trotted out" so often. Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #106

The more relevant question would be Dreamer Tatum Jul 2016 #20

This.nt clarice Jul 2016 #36

You don't try to counter snipers with a concealed handgun. Lizzie Poppet Jul 2016 #21

Do you seriously believe their were no Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #27

In the area? Sure. In someone's possession at a location to actually get a shot? Doubtful. Lizzie Poppet Jul 2016 #31

What, a person of color with an AR? Duckhunter935 Jul 2016 #48

Plenty of rifles AND handguns. For self-defense, not a private police force, ye of little faith... Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #108

Money quote is at 2:03... backscatter712 Jul 2016 #23

Lawbreakers? You meant murderers of course.nt clarice Jul 2016 #24

Ok, where were all the good guys with guns Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #25

Probably home with their families, getting ready for work the next day.nt clarice Jul 2016 #35

So, no good guys with guns were to found in the middle of Dallas? Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #39

And if there had been... you would be first one yelling... clarice Jul 2016 #40

You see something that is not there Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #41

ok.nt clarice Jul 2016 #59

Heh-heh. On the nose. Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #109

it was nearly 9pm. who is out on the streets at that time but dangerous thugs? nt uncle ray Jul 2016 #71

Good point Uncle Ray. nt clarice Jul 2016 #86

I'm guessing, that to avoid ending up like that guy in Minnesota, they left them at home. krispos42 Jul 2016 #28

Yep, you're right. Only the police should be trusted to carry guns. nt jonno99 Jul 2016 #32

With appropriate accountability Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #38

"Yes, we've had it so many times before." ( Apologies to Ed McMahon) Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #110

Seems like a great way to end up dead inwiththenew Jul 2016 #33

Oh, I agree, Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #37

Right after you explain why the laws didn't prevent it. N/T beevul Jul 2016 #54

The "laws" such as they are, Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #62

Do they also allow murder? beevul Jul 2016 #70

This is a subject in which the ignorant are often proud of their ignorance friendly_iconoclast Jul 2016 #73

Habitually. N/T beevul Jul 2016 #74

Does the law allow murder? Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #76

Yes. 'Military grade' is funny. beevul Jul 2016 #79

Equivalent, to a round normally fired by a bolt-action rifle. Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #82

So what? beevul Jul 2016 #83

I stand by my views Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #84

Of course you do. beevul Jul 2016 #85

I thought we whined when "good guys with guns" show up at protests? ileus Jul 2016 #44

How do I tell the difference between a "good guy with a gun" and Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #66

Do you want every person sarisataka Jul 2016 #52

Kind of my point about the stupidity of the argument. Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #64

What types of people would you prohibit? Marengo Jul 2016 #77

The mentally ill, Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #78

I think your confusion lies in thinking so many lawful gun owners are "Rambo wanna-be heroes". jmg257 Jul 2016 #58

However, it is the argument offered against restricting Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #63

Running to WalMart... arthritisR_US Jul 2016 #65

That was #1 on my list of reasons Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #67

Bingo! nt arthritisR_US Jul 2016 #68

You are a good guy with a gun, until that nanosecond you decide to become a bad guy with a gun. Rex Jul 2016 #72

Ah, the Magic Force Field theory again. Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #111

crapping their pants Skittles Jul 2016 #75

Who are cowards? oneshooter Jul 2016 #89

Penis-talk gives way to self-defacation. Dialog improves, but it doesn't clear the atmosphere! Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #112

It was an ambush. joshcryer Jul 2016 #80

Again, despite these events being planned Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #81

Being detained on suspicion. arely staircase Jul 2016 #92

Again, that would kind of render the argument Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #93

They don't hang out at BLM events. BKH70041 Jul 2016 #97

It's Texas Kelvin Mace Jul 2016 #98

Nah! BKH70041 Jul 2016 #99

Contrary to popular belief, not everyone in Texas is armed to the teeth. TwilightZone Jul 2016 #102